when you make a remark like 'If Complexio would not have shot any bullet at all this version it would be sky high on the number one position, as well as the whole alliance we are in.' you ARE claiming you are better than other families. Imagine if other families had not shot at all this version as well. Do you really think complexio would be number 1? It's eazy to say 'if everyone else shot and we didnt we would have the most bullets.' But if you say that about all families, would you really be number 1? Hopefully you understand my point.

regardless, respect to you guys for actually shooting this version, because there are a lot of sad sad fams who didnt even do that. we all know there are some top 5 families who got there via not shooting for 6+ months, which is unbelievable for me. really disgusting, and quite pathetic. what is the point of playing this game if your just going to hug. you have GOT to have better things to do, either in RL or in other games or you are extraordinarily easily entertained.

mad props to people who are still shooting atm. I am getting incredibly frustrated just posting to RIPs with all these service time-outs. I cant begin to imagine what a pain in the ass it must be to be shooting right now with the servers in the state they are.

it's only arrogance if your wrong

I 100% agree with you we were saved by bloods several times. Isn't that what bloods are about? Helping each other out? We actually had 5 top 20 accounts at 1 point. Along with 3 separate accounts throughout the version that were #1 at one point or another. I think you can just say the version went real well for us. But please don't use that as a basis for calling us cheaters. We had one of the lowest A-kill ratio's of any of the large fams. I suppose you can say what you want but fact is, we play to play. As should you, be a good sport.

Thanks for making this about Presidential even though there are a million other families fighting their socks off.

P.S. ex camorra actually COULDNT clean us up... they tried while most of our fam was asleep and we ate them alive lol... didnt even get credit for that war cuz it was so short lived. i assume since you made that remark you are ex camorra, RIP to you as well.

you jelly bro? but seriously i would appreciate it if you didnt insinuate im a cheater.

you and sabra finally moving in together eh? lol

a lot more than that actually ;). 20 is just my personal count.

Well err, im assuming they know how to check rank pos. Every single DR could have been taken in 1 shot... no preshots necessary. Despite your claims, the 60k shot days are not long gone, you just have to shoot right and have the correct bg load out. Regardless though, decent shooting by Aspava... RIP Dead Rabbits.

First off major props to what Athenamoia said, couldnt agree more. And just to respond to this remark by loverboy.

You make an assumption that does not hold true, that we would shoot you a few days later. We had no intentions or desire too, we (or at least I) like you guys as a family. No point in kicking a dead dog.

Secondly, it's tough to ask Deston what he would do as Presidential would never be in this situation. We have been as careful as they come with object acquisition. We had shot in 7(i think?) wars and had at least 8+ GF kills before we got our first true fam object in late June. We were very careful to not hold more objects than we thought we could handle defending/funding. For this reason we would never be in this situations. We would have given our objects to bloods (as we've done with errr... 4 objects so far I believe?).

Granted I wouldnt have given them up to enemies in your position, but i sure as hell wouldnt have held onto them. You talk about being concerned about looking like a noob fam, how would we have looked if we just sat back while you stuck your tongues out at us over those objects. We gave you guys a great offer, you just chose to reject it unfortunately. And now you guys get to rerank and i get to turn my focus back to RL... damnit. :p

And as for zeveroare... you are clearly new to this game if you refer to Presidential as noobs over a fam name. get real kid... and read up on your Omerta history. Your gonna have beef with a lot more old school families with grander histories than your little mind can process if you think a non-conventional fam name is synonymous with noobs.

Don't even get me started Mojo. Really, don't say anything else that would give me incentive to obliterate what little credibility you have.

It's also worth mentioning that the way you discovered you had a leak was by one of your own leaks... so really your just calling the kettle black. I've said it once, I'll say it again, leaks are part of the game. Very unfortunate, and ill admit unsavory, but you would be a fool not to use em. Furthermore, don't float your account hugger bullshit up in here. We took on a fam 1.5x our size 1 v 1 because we knew they would jump us if we hit anyone else. We ended up getting hit by 3 of you all together. The only attempted gangbang that happened was the counter on us. Don't you dare call us huggers. I think temp are some brave mofo's but people like you, anon, give them a bad name. RIP all who died.

ladies ladies, please. Can't we all just be friends!?

"Unknown reasons"... wut? lol

Anyone notice that two fluffy members (including the don) hitlisted Desteny, Trafficante donna for almost 200mil. Looks like a known reason to me.

This also adds incentive for attacking families to finish wars. You need to completely destroy a family otherwise they will still maintain their previously built up ks bonus. i like this one.

err, isnt that like rule #1 in the bible?

"Ye shall go forth, but harm not, or thou art a terrorizor.
Unless ye be of the United States, in which case I say unto thee,
go forth and plunder without fear of consequence."

... pretty sure it's written in the book of Genesis... right after that part about creating the earth in a few days

pff outbidders, no respect tsk tsk

Well, I'd love to embark on a quest to purge a host of the lesser fams in the game, and I'm sure it would be quite fun and entail minimal losses. The problem for the top 10 fams, if one of us takes it upon ourselves to eliminate the bottom 10-15 families, other families in the top 10 will attack us. As such, we must save our bullets for the big boys. However, I strongly encourage other bottom 80 fams to take it upon themselves to thin their ranks. Its ridiculous.

I would also like to point out for the sake of pointing it out that if any of the top 20 fams turned to purging the lower 20 fams, the amount of shit they would get from everyone for being 'pussies attacking helpless families' would be insurmountable. not that others opinions of our actions should define our decisions, but just pointing out the hypocrisy inherent in forums like this.

I agree that the player base has become corrupted but there is no real point in languishing in the past. I despise the gangbanging as much as the next guy but as you said, its the way the game has evolved. Families are so interconnected with bloods, that unless you attack with many, you face heavy retaliation from the targets bloods. As such the attacking force must assert itself using overwhelming force to discourage reprisal. We may not like gangbanging, but its the way the game has evolved... we just gotta deal with it.

If we want more wars in this game then we need to increase the incentive to fight. To do so admins need to adjust the way poker is incorporated into this game or remove it completely to increase the value of objects. BTW Reborn you can't compare anything post-2.4 to 'old days.' The entire dynamic of the game has changed. And also dont talk about honor/balls... especially in an online game like this it just sounds ridiculous. I'm guessing families jumped in cuz they wanted to fight, not because carneglia was desperately looking for help.